Curse

Orange Milk · Jul 03, 2008, 03:32 PM // 15:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by arienrhode
Try this:

Ranger / Necromancer
10 Curses
12 Beast Mastery
8 Expertise

Core Barbs5210Hex Spell. For 30 seconds, target foe takes 10 more damage when hit by physical damage. (Attrib: 10 Curses)

Core Mark of Pain20110Hex Spell. For 30 seconds, whenever target foe takes physical damage, Mark of Pain deals 30 shadow damage to adjacent foes. (Attrib: 10 Curses)

Core Ferocious Strike85(3)Elite Pet Attack. Your animal companion attempts a Ferocious Strike that deals +25 damage. If that attack hits, you gain adrenaline and 9 Energy. (Attrib: 12 Beast Mastery)

Factions Poisonous Bite75(3)Pet Attack. Your animal companion attempts a Poisonous Bite that Poisons target foe for 17 seconds. (Attrib: 12 Beast Mastery)

EotN Feral Aggression2015(10)Skill. For 17 seconds, your pet attacks 33% faster and deals 9 additional damage. (Attrib: 12 Beast Mastery)

Core Charm Animal1010(7)Skill. Charm target animal. Once charmed, your animal companion will travel with you whenever you have Charm Animal equipped. (Attrib: 12 Beast Mastery)

Core Comfort Animal1110(7)Skill. You heal your animal companion for 87 Health. If your companion is dead, it is resurrected with 48% Health. (Attrib: 12 Beast Mastery)

Core Resurrection Signet3Signet. Resurrect target party member. That party member is returned to life with 100% Health and 25% Energy. This Signet only recharges when you gain a morale boost.

Im going to go ahead and on a scale of 1-10 give this build a 0.7, and thats simply for having a rez.

Using a weapon that does half dmg is a VERY bad idea. Who cares if you trigger buffs when you do no dmg to start with, I guess you just hope there is no hex remover around. Leave the Hexes to your SABway necros please. Plus no IAS = 1/4 your damage of a full dmg spear WITH an IAS.

You have NO spammable skills that require you to have the need to constanlty get 9 energy or ANY Addrenialine, FStrike is a GREAT skill in the right build, this is not it, you lack damage, go do some with an better elite.

Drop the hexes for a Spear attack Energy or addrenal based is no matter and an IAS, drop Posion bite for Great Dwarf Weapon, cast it on your pet. Now you have a reason for your elite.

Though there are better Pack Hunter builds out there, at least this is a start now.

Krill · Jul 03, 2008, 04:22 PM // 16:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orange Milk

You have NO spammable skills that require you to have the need to constanlty get 9 energy or ANY Addrenialine, FStrike is a GREAT skill in the right build, this is not it, you lack damage, go do some with an better elite.

Drop the hexes for a Spear attack Energy or addrenal based is no matter and an IAS, drop Posion bite for Great Dwarf Weapon, cast it on your pet. Now you have a reason for your elite.

Though there are better Pack Hunter builds out there, at least this is a start now.

The point of ferocious strike is to gain energy (10 to be exact) to reapply barbs and mark of pain on new targets. Nobody uses it to gain adrenaline, 1 strike every 8 seconds = woo hoo nothing.

The IAS in the build is [feral aggression] for your pet which also does bonus damage and stays up 100% of the time with 16 in BM.

The only reason to carry a spear is to fling it at your target every 1.5 seconds to trigger barbs and mark of pain more. It's common in practice in PvP for teams that run a barbs spike to have everyone fling a spear if they can at the barbed target to trigger it as much as possible.

I guarantee that barbs and mark of pain does more damage than rinky dink spear attacks when mark of pain is hitting adjacent targets. If you don't believe me to go Isle of the Nameless with that build, put barbs and mark of pain on the Master of Damage and see what happens when you and your pet attack him and hit the adjacent dummies. In fact I'm going to go out on a limb and say it does far more damage than splinter barrage but it's not as mobile since you have to cast the hexes first.

As for the comment about hex removal, afaik monsters don't remove hexes very often (if at all).

You can dump the rez signet sure, but I usually carry one when there is not a skill that is absolutely necessary to make a build work. There are no additional skills needed to make this build work.

And I'll admit I don't know much about the PvE only EoTN skills because I have not played EoTN at all. There are some great skills avaliable sure but not everyone has advanced those titles so recommending them in builds isn't always a win.

Orange Milk · Jul 03, 2008, 06:56 PM // 18:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by arienrhode
The point of ferocious strike is to gain energy (10 to be exact) to reapply barbs and mark of pain on new targets

I know what the skill does, I didn't know you were barbs/Mark of pain EVERY target, so I guess I see why you need the energy. One question though, while you are busy casting hexes whos chucking spears and creating all that uber Dmg? Ya know for this part of what you said:

Quote:

The only reason to carry a spear is to fling it at your target every 1.5 seconds to trigger barbs and mark of pain more.

Barbs is a 2 sec cast, and if your casting it on everyone around, thats gonna be alot of spears not chucked, like I said, Leave the Hexing to your SABway Necros. Also:

Quote:

It's common in practice in PvP for teams that run a barbs spike to have everyone fling a spear if they can at the barbed target to trigger it as much as possible.

When did this "High end PvE" thread become a PvP barbs Spike thread? Also isn't there a necro involved in those spikes?

Quote:

I guarantee that barbs and mark of pain does more damage than rinky dink spear attacks when mark of pain is hitting adjacent targets. If you don't believe me to go Isle of the Nameless with that build, put barbs and mark of pain on the Master of Damage and see what happens when you and your pet attack him and hit the adjacent dummies

Have your Necro Hero put barbs and MoP on the Master of Damage and you put 12 in spear add a spear attack AND an IAS and have you and your pet attack you will do about 2-3 times the ammount of Damage you are doing now.

As for AI Monsters removing Hexs, The OP asked about "High End" PvE, where monsters have mad skillz, lulz.

Quote:

You can dump the rez signet sure

NO WAY, thats what your build got .7 points for.

Quote:

There are no additional skills needed to make this build work

You sure about that?

Quote:

And I'll admit I don't know much about the PvE only EoTN skills because I have not played EoTN at all. There are some great skills avaliable sure but not everyone has advanced those titles so recommending them in builds isn't always a win

Your failure to take advantage of the skills available to you does not constitute a reason for me to not suggest them. BTW, no EOTN eh? Then why suggest the EoTN skill Feral Aggression in the build? Hmmmm....

SnipiousMax · Jul 03, 2008, 07:20 PM // 19:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by arienrhode

...tbh the dps from spears isn't that great...

if by 'isn't that great' you mean 'good' then I agree. Spears are one of the better sources of DPS in guildwars.

KycooGhost · Jul 03, 2008, 11:22 PM // 23:22

back on topic... -.-

Pure beastmasters aren't good for high end pve because 1. pets atack once every 2 secs while a bow is about once every 1.5 secs. 2. Pets wont do as much damage as a barager or even a single target ranger. 3. Some times pets will randomly re-target or come back to you. 4. Pets have lower armor than rangers 5. A Dire pet will have -60 hp and +12-14% dmg and a hearty pet will have +60hp but -12-14%dmg. neither is good when in DoA or FoW or UW.

Krill · Jul 04, 2008, 02:47 AM // 02:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orange Milk

Your failure to take advantage of the skills available to you does not constitute a reason for me to not suggest them. BTW, no EOTN eh? Then why suggest the EoTN skill Feral Aggression in the build? Hmmmm....

I bought EoTN when it was released and have yet to play it, I just use the skills.

The guy asked for a beastmaster build for high end pve and I gave him one that on its own can do a lot of damage vs. mobs of high level monsters like splinter barraging. I have played packhunter plenty in pvp and all it's good for is rapidly spamming poison and bleeding on many targets and spamming an unblockable enraged lunge on monks. The damage of spears vs. high armor targets (i.e. high level pve) blows ass as there are not many non-elite, non-suck spear attacks with bonus damage. Spear of lightning, vicious attack and blazing spear are the only decent ones but you won't be landing many criticals for viscous attack with 12 in spear mastery and no critical buffs. Not to mention many high level monsters are not fleshy so there goes your poison and bleeding spam too with a packhunter.

Of course you can run packhunter with a nec putting the hexes on but unless you are on vent with an experienced group, most pve pugers pay zero attention to what's going on and fail to put hexes on the target you want to hit, if targets are even called or the right ones are called. This is really no different than a ranger carrying mark of rodgort to throw on mobs for barraging.

And one last note on pet AI, if you double tap the lock icon on a new target after the old ones dies and don't distance yourself too much from your pet it won't start running back to you and will instantly move onto the new one. It's still annoying and clumsy to control a pet but it can be usable if you really want to do all beastmaster.

Cherng Butter · Jul 04, 2008, 03:54 AM // 03:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by KycooGhost

back on topic... -.-

Pure beastmasters aren't good for high end pve because 1. pets atack once every 2 secs while a bow is about once every 1.5 secs. 2. Pets wont do as much damage as a barager or even a single target ranger. 3. Some times pets will randomly re-target or come back to you. 4. Pets have lower armor than rangers 5. A Dire pet will have -60 hp and +12-14% dmg and a hearty pet will have +60hp but -12-14%dmg. neither is good when in DoA or FoW or UW.

I thought bows attack 2-2.7 o.O

Orange Milk · Jul 07, 2008, 01:38 PM // 13:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by arienrhode
The damage of spears vs. high armor targets (i.e. high level pve) blows ass

So you figure just put "0" in spear and reduce that dmg even more? BRILLIANT!!!

Lets see here, you have a spear with "0" so you get half DMG, unless it's a collector spear then you get even less, SO each spear hits for 7-14ish Dmg before armor, with a MUCH higher chance of that "7" rolling due to your "0" Your looking at an Average Damage of say 5 vs a high armor target (100 AR). Add your barbs damage (12, assuming 12 in curses) and your hitting for 17 every 1.5 secs. (not counting Vamp or Sundering, assuming 15% + 20% custom) With a 1% Crit Chance rate

Now, lets drop barbs and the whole necro idea to begin with and toss a "12" in spear your gonna hit for about 16.3 every 1.5 secs (vs 100 AR), However I would have added an IAS, so now thats every 3/4 secs I'm getting 16.3, (not counting Vamp or Sundering, assuming 15% + 20% custom) Also with a "12" in Spear your looking at a 17% - 19.2% (depending on who's numbers you use) Crit Chance Rate

So with an IAS and an Crit Hits I'm doing more than double the damage from your build, not counting attack skills.

Granted you loose your AoE Dmg from Mark of Pain, but then your using that on one target every 30 seconds and hope his buddies surround him. Also you are loosing the Pet Attacks activating the barbs, But I think the IAS more than makes up for that with your Spear at more power.

Quote:

Of course you can run packhunter with a nec putting the hexes on but unless you are on vent with an experienced group, most pve pugers pay zero attention to what's going on and fail to put hexes on the target you want to hit, if targets are even called or the right ones are called.

A) Don't PUG
B) Dicsuss it prior to, ask the Necro to call his barbs, if he won't just attack the target with the little purple triangle next to his name. Take a Hero Necro and micro him.

Read hear and learn stuffs:

http://www.oildrip.com/calc/index.php

Here too:

http://guildwars.wikia.com/wiki/Attack_speed

Bottom line, unless your are using some wack obscure farm build, if your attacking and attempting to deal damage, meet your weapons requirement at the least.

Lishy · Jul 09, 2008, 07:19 AM // 07:19

I never really see pets actually used GOOD anymore. Most people I see have pets just for the heck of it.
Is there any reason why? I really want a phoenix, but after that, I would of accomplished nothing and the whole thing would be pointless.

Kyomi Tachibana · Jul 09, 2008, 07:25 AM // 07:25

I use a pet on my ranger in PvE for [Never Rampage Alone], it doesn't have the speed boost but it has the IAS which is important and frees up the elite slot for more useful things like [Earth shaker].

Darkobra · Jul 09, 2008, 07:51 AM // 07:51

Rather a pet that doesn't suffer death penalty being attacked than a vital party member.

Ben-A-BoO · Jul 09, 2008, 07:51 AM // 07:51

Well,
Pets are fun to be around with. They are not the ultimate Cookie cutter's but they can kill stuff, tank damage and take no DP in PvE.

Packhunter Heroes (Something like this) do fine and are micro manage free most of the time ... I love to have three of them around me; really feels like hunting season.

As for yourself: what Kyomi Tachibana said plus [[Great Dwarf weapon] if you have it. For PvE I use [[ferocious strike] since [[never rampage alone] provides the IAS for me.

There are serveral builds posted here around 'beastmaster's' just dig around a bit ... here is a bar I made a while ago ... PvE Thumper

Have fun!

Rhamia Darigaz · Jul 09, 2008, 07:53 AM // 07:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyomi Tachibana

I use a pet on my ranger in PvE for [Never Rampage Alone], it doesn't have the speed boost but it has the IAS which is important and frees up the elite slot for more useful things like [Earth shaker].

in an attempt to find a use for my ranger's destroyer maul ive actually been using that same variant on the RaO build, with ["I do big domage"] instead of a spirit. not only is it easier on energy and the elite's more useful, [never rampage alone]'s regen counters the degen from my vamp hammer(!).

Artisan Archer · Jul 09, 2008, 08:04 AM // 08:04

I use:
Whirling Defence, "I am the strongest", Rampage as One, Spear of Fury, "Dodge This", Comfort Animal, Charm Animal, Res sig.

It's good for general damage.

-Lotus- · Jul 09, 2008, 08:14 AM // 08:14

unfortunatly pets a basically a self-blakout every once in awhile with little to no benefit. I wish they were useful :/

Rhamia Darigaz · Jul 09, 2008, 08:20 AM // 08:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Lotus-

unfortunatly pets a basically a self-blakout every once in awhile with little to no benefit. I wish they were useful :/

fortunately while ur black-ed out you're holding a hammer, so you can autoattack and not be totally worthless.
bringing a pet has its advantages in letting you bring [bestial mauling], [rampage as one] or [never rampage alone]. they also add some damage.
of course thats all assuming we're talking about thumpers

Charlotte the Harlot · Jul 09, 2008, 08:58 AM // 08:58

using ferocious strike to fuel conc shot and other high energy attacks is kind of cool not great but probably one of the more interesting beast mastery combos.

Syn Wind · Jul 09, 2008, 09:11 AM // 09:11

ok , about pets too i recently discovered, that rangers can charm pets higher
level, than they are, i made ranger got to level 4 and charmed a level 5 warthog, which i didnt think was possible, but apparently so ! O.o as i was thinking of hunter in warcraft , so i thought perhaps gw rangers were similar, but thats kind cool having a pet higher than u if u want to solo low areas = )

odly · Jul 09, 2008, 10:38 AM // 10:38

Pet's take too much skill bar space.
They aren't good in themselfves, so you need to use beastmastery skills as well to benefit from the attribute points you put into it.

Pet's take too much attributes.
I believe you need 12 in beastmastery to make a pet do as much damage as a hammer with 9 in hammer mastery, but I might be wrong there.
High attributes are not bad if you consider them being a second weapon, but you'll still want to do damage with your own weapon as well. (well I like to anyway)

Pet's have bad pathing and get bodyblocked.
Pet attack skills don't queue.
I really hate this, due to the bad pathing they don't execute the attack skills as fast as expected and then you're accidentally removing it by commanding another skill.

Pet's look pretty.

Beastmastery does have a couple nice skills though, here are some of my favourites.
[Feral Aggression] [enraged lunge] [Predator's pounce]

Pet's trigger barbs, and benefit from ebon battle standard of honour.
Pet's do interupt when your target is dazed from broadhead arrow.
Pet's can be enchanted with weapon spells.
(Is there a select pet keyboard control ? I don't think so, but I whish theer was one.)

isamu kurosawa · Jul 09, 2008, 11:46 AM // 11:46

Pet build in PvE can be fun and although they are not the absolute best they are much better than what most people in PUGs run.

If it's general pve then you should have no problem, in it's HM then its best to use such a build in a guild/alliance team you are comfortable with if at all.

Not to mention a pet has higher AL than a caster.